Scottish Rovers

Scottish Football Answers to Questions
Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Sat Sep 07, 2013 11:27 am

This is what I have on Alexander Crichton - it would be great if our investigations tally. The local Bristol press refers to him as a "Scottish Junior international". It is pretty much the briefest biography of any post-WW1 Bristol Rovers player at present; for many I have parents names, etc. Does anyone here have access to a website which would give details of his parents, siblings, wife or children? Where did he go next in 1926? He did not feature in Rovers' reserve side, Oct-Dec 1925, but was briefly back in the reserves after New Year. Let's see ....


ALEXANDER CRICHTON
b 12.6.1899 Bellshill, Scotland
5’ 10”; 11 st 10 lbs WH
Début: 29.8.25 v Charlton Athletic
Career: 1923 Blantyre Victoria; May 1924 Bradford Park Avenue; 11.6.25 Bristol Rovers [7,0] (to 1926).

Scottish Junior international wing-half and Park Avenue reserve Alec Crichton appeared for Blues against Whites in Rovers’ pre-season trial game in August 1925, a 2-2 draw, and played in Rovers’ first five League games of the 1925-26 season. Thereafter, he does not feature in reserve team line-ups and may have returned north of the border.

bluedragon
Posts: 945
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by bluedragon » Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:24 pm

Thanks for the information that I think now shows we are looking at different players.

I have found newspaper reports showing Alec Crichton as a Blantyre Victoria player in season 1923/24. Another report of the club's AGM in Summer 1924 does not list him in the list of players re-signed for the next season. This is obviously consistent with what you have, i.e. joining Bradford Park Avenue in May 1924.

I have found a birth certificate for 12th June 1899. His birth certificate is marked as illegitimate. His mother was Catherine Crichton - domestic servant. He was born at 55 Muirpark Cottages, Bellshill. In a match report from 1924 he is referred to as a "Holytown lad" so perhaps that is where he grew up?

The reference to him as a Scottish Junior International is more difficult. As I said before he is not in the list of internationals. I have gone back to look at the selections made around two weeks before each game. In those days they picked the starting line-up and a shadow reserve eleven to cover for injuries, call offs, etc. before the game. As far as I can see he was not even selected as a reserve. Depending on your source it may be confused with my Crichton who was capped in 1925.

I found a report in the Daily Mail from 22nd May 1925 saying-

"Bristol Rovers have signed on Alec Crichton, a wing half-back from Bradford from whom he joined from Blantyre Victoria last season".

This confirms that - unlikely as it may seem - he did not return to Junior football in Scotland after a short spell at Bradford and got capped in 1925 (i.e. my Crichton) before signing for Bristol Rovers.

If I pick up anything else when looking for my chap I will let you know.

.

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Sat Sep 07, 2013 4:21 pm

Thank you for your input into this. Yes, it looks like we have different players here. Do let me know if anything turns up and I will, of course, do likewise.

bluedragon
Posts: 945
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by bluedragon » Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:12 pm

Bristol Rovers wrote:Thank you for your input into this. Yes, it looks like we have different players here. Do let me know if anything turns up and I will, of course, do likewise.
I now know my "Crichton" is "W Crichton" - I am fairly sure it is "William" - so that definitely confirms we have two different "Crichtons".

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Fri Mar 23, 2018 11:18 am

Just moving this back to the top of the list - sorry! Does anyone have any dates of birth/death, as initially listed? Very grateful for any feedback.

I am looking for accurate dates of birth for the following:
Andrew Dick (Aberdeen, 1922-24), born Aberdeen 1900, died in Kennoway (date?)
Alexander Millar (East Fife, 1933-35, 1943 Hearts, 1947 Forfar Ath), 1915-1973 (any dates?) (does anyone have details of apps/goals at Hearts or Forfar?)
Robert Plenderleith (East Fife, 1927-28), born in Fife 1909, died 30.4.74 London
Frank/Francis Roberts, born Motherwell 1902, died ? (in 1920s at Queen's Park, Cowdenbeath, Rangers three times apparently, Alloa A, St Johnstone, Ayr U)

And accurate dates of death for:
George McIntosh Barton (Raith R, 1921-28), 15.10.99 - died Weston-super-Mare 3q 1970
Michael Docherty Cosgrove (Aberdeen, 1924-28) 20.5.01- Dec 1972 Erie, New York
Alexander Crichton (Blantyre Vics, 1923-24) 12.6.99 - died?
Alexander Donald (Partick Th, 1925-26) - was he at Dunfermline Ath, 1936-37? (apps?) - 29.5.00 - died? (perhaps had a brother John - anyone know?)
Alexander Findlay (Musselburgh Bruntonians, 1929-30), 26.12.02 - died Oct 85 Bristol - was he a brother of William (Liverpool, Leicester C, Watford, 1900-49)
Frederick James Forbes (Hearts, 1920-22, Leith A, 31-32, Airdrie, 33-34) 5.8.94 - died?
Robert Gardiner (Dundee U, 33-36, 41-2) 2.9.12 - died Apr 93 Dundee
William Blyth Gillespie (East Fife - 356 apps, I believe - was he at St Mirren, 30-31(apps?)) - 29.10.03 - died?
David Brown Kenny (Falkirk, 11-12 - apps/goals?) 22.5.91 - died?
Alfred King (St Bernard's, 1931- apps/gls?) 6.6.06 - died?
Robert McKay (Scottish cap, 1927) 2.9.00 - died 1977? (says Wikipedia)
John Wilson Paterson (Wellesley Juniors, 1927-28) 13.4.04 - died Canada?
James Smith (66 gls in season man) - date of death in Bridgepoint, Connecticut in 1975?
John Thom (Hurlford Thistle, 1916-22) 18.5.99 - died Aug 66 Aldershot
John Yungmann Thomson (Partick Th, 23-4) 27.7.96 - died May 80 Westchester, New York
William Thomson (Clyde, 12-14, Arthurlie, 15-16 - apps/gls?) born Parkhead 3.1.95 - died?
John Boyd Watson (St Anthony's, Glasgow, 30-32) born Govan 14.8.10 - died Tunbridge Wells, 1978
William Walter White (ex-Musselburgh Bruntonians) born Kirkcaldy 26.7.07 - died?

ScottishFA
Posts: 1177
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 2:21 pm
Location: Dunblane
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by ScottishFA » Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:30 pm

Bobby McKay (Robert McInnes McKay) died 10 June 1977 in Glasgow.

Gordon Baird
Posts: 200
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:37 am
Location: Paignton
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Gordon Baird » Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:35 pm

Alex Donald made seven league appearances for Dunfermline in 1936/37, without scoring. All seven ended in defeat with thirty goals conceded.

From information supplied by another Rovers historian, Stephen Byrne, Alex Donald died on 6 July 1974 in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada. John was his younger brother.

Angusfifer
Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:49 am
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Angusfifer » Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:24 am

Willie Gillespie died in 1978 in Buckhaven, Fife. I am in the process of researching dates of birth and death of East Fife players, so will hopefully be able to provide you with a precise date of death in the near future.
Alex Millar was born 20.1.1915 in Coaltown of Balgonie, Fife and died 3.7.1973 in Kirkcaldy, Fife...

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:49 pm

Sorry - I never saw this reply and many years have gone by. This is what I have on Alec Crichton. He does not feature at Rovers after the end of September 1925 and I have no idea where he went then. Did you find any other player who fits the bill or might they have been one and the same? I have found a photo of him, but no date of death, as yet.



ALEXANDER CRICHTON
b 12.6.1899 Bellshill, Scotland
5’ 10”; 11 st 10 lbs WH
Début: 29.8.25 v Charlton Athletic
Career: 1923 Blantyre Victoria; May 1924 Bradford Park Avenue; 11.6.25 Bristol Rovers [7,0] (to 1926).

Scottish Junior international wing-half and Park Avenue reserve Alec Crichton appeared for Blues against Whites in Rovers’ pre-season trial game in August 1925, a 2-2 draw, and played in Rovers’ first five League games of the 1925-26 season. Thereafter, he does not feature in reserve team line-ups and may have returned north of the border. He was born at 55 Muirpark Cottages, Bellshill to an unmarried domestic servant, Catherine Crichton.

Gordon Baird
Posts: 200
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:37 am
Location: Paignton
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Gordon Baird » Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:12 pm

Regarding Alex Donald, his accepted date of birth seems to be incorrect. He was actually born on 3 May 1898 in Kirkintilloch, and died there on 10 April 1952. There's an obituary in the Kirkintilloch Herald of 16 April which lays out his playing career.

There was another Alex Donald born in Kirkintilloch on 29 May 1900 - this would appear to be the man who died in Canada in 1974. Strangely, this is the date of birth attributed to the footballer in Michael Joyce's Football League Players' Records.

The footballer didn't have a brother named John but his namesake did, born in 1902.

bluedragon
Posts: 945
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by bluedragon » Mon Jun 21, 2021 8:33 pm

Bristol Rovers wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:49 pm
Sorry - I never saw this reply and many years have gone by. This is what I have on Alec Crichton. He does not feature at Rovers after the end of September 1925 and I have no idea where he went then. Did you find any other player who fits the bill or might they have been one and the same? I have found a photo of him, but no date of death, as yet.



ALEXANDER CRICHTON
b 12.6.1899 Bellshill, Scotland
5’ 10”; 11 st 10 lbs WH
Début: 29.8.25 v Charlton Athletic
Career: 1923 Blantyre Victoria; May 1924 Bradford Park Avenue; 11.6.25 Bristol Rovers [7,0] (to 1926).

Scottish Junior international wing-half and Park Avenue reserve Alec Crichton appeared for Blues against Whites in Rovers’ pre-season trial game in August 1925, a 2-2 draw, and played in Rovers’ first five League games of the 1925-26 season. Thereafter, he does not feature in reserve team line-ups and may have returned north of the border. He was born at 55 Muirpark Cottages, Bellshill to an unmarried domestic servant, Catherine Crichton.
Since the earlier posts I have found the correct surname spelling of Willie Creighton (Bridgeton Waverley) who was an inside right who won two Junior International caps in 1925 against Wales (11 April 1925) and England (18 April 1925). However, he was still at Bridgeton Waverley in November 1926.

Alex Crichton (Blantyre Victoria) did not play for the Scottish Junior International team. However, at around his time the Lanarkshire Junior League had regular matches against the Irish Intermediate League and the newspapers often described these players as “Junior Internationalists”. I could not find him playing for the Lanarkshire League but details are sketchy.

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:54 am

Gordon Baird wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:12 pm
Regarding Alex Donald, his accepted date of birth seems to be incorrect. He was actually born on 3 May 1898 in Kirkintilloch, and died there on 10 April 1952. There's an obituary in the Kirkintilloch Herald of 16 April which lays out his playing career.

There was another Alex Donald born in Kirkintilloch on 29 May 1900 - this would appear to be the man who died in Canada in 1974. Strangely, this is the date of birth attributed to the footballer in Michael Joyce's Football League Players' Records.

The footballer didn't have a brother named John but his namesake did, born in 1902.
Thank you for your clarification on all this. I have amended my biography of Alex Donald. Do you happen to have the name (and dates?) of the wife of the footballer?

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Wed Jun 23, 2021 9:55 am

bluedragon wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 8:33 pm
Bristol Rovers wrote:
Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:49 pm
Sorry - I never saw this reply and many years have gone by. This is what I have on Alec Crichton. He does not feature at Rovers after the end of September 1925 and I have no idea where he went then. Did you find any other player who fits the bill or might they have been one and the same? I have found a photo of him, but no date of death, as yet.



ALEXANDER CRICHTON
b 12.6.1899 Bellshill, Scotland
5’ 10”; 11 st 10 lbs WH
Début: 29.8.25 v Charlton Athletic
Career: 1923 Blantyre Victoria; May 1924 Bradford Park Avenue; 11.6.25 Bristol Rovers [7,0] (to 1926).

Scottish Junior international wing-half and Park Avenue reserve Alec Crichton appeared for Blues against Whites in Rovers’ pre-season trial game in August 1925, a 2-2 draw, and played in Rovers’ first five League games of the 1925-26 season. Thereafter, he does not feature in reserve team line-ups and may have returned north of the border. He was born at 55 Muirpark Cottages, Bellshill to an unmarried domestic servant, Catherine Crichton.
Since the earlier posts I have found the correct surname spelling of Willie Creighton (Bridgeton Waverley) who was an inside right who won two Junior International caps in 1925 against Wales (11 April 1925) and England (18 April 1925). However, he was still at Bridgeton Waverley in November 1926.

Alex Crichton (Blantyre Victoria) did not play for the Scottish Junior International team. However, at around his time the Lanarkshire Junior League had regular matches against the Irish Intermediate League and the newspapers often described these players as “Junior Internationalists”. I could not find him playing for the Lanarkshire League but details are sketchy.
Thank you for your reply. I can see they are clearly two different players. Alec Crichton vanished off the scene in the autumn of 1925 and his whereabouts after that date remain unknown ....

Gordon Baird
Posts: 200
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:37 am
Location: Paignton
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Gordon Baird » Wed Jun 23, 2021 5:50 pm

Alex Donald's wife was Helen Campbell Kay (1900 to 1966). They were married on 16 February 1923 at the Parish Church, Kirkintilloch. He was the oldest son of Kenneth Donald and Mary McLean McWilliams, who were living at 49 Victoria Street at the time of the marriage and had been since at least 1915, when their daughter Lizzie died.

The other Alex Donald sailed for Canada with his father James on 10 March 1922. Their address on the passenger list was given as...49 Victoria Street, Kirkintilloch.

They may have been cousins. Perhaps Alex gave the other's date of birth (29 May 1900) when he joined Chelsea to appear younger than he actually was?

Bristol Rovers
Posts: 211
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:04 am
Location: Turi, Kenya
Contact:

Re: Scottish Rovers

Post by Bristol Rovers » Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:23 pm

Thank you for all this extra detail. Much appreciated. No wonder people told me he had gone to Canada, seeing as the address is the same. Thanks for clarifying.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 4 guests