Global city average crowds

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Scottish
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Global city average crowds

Post by Scottish » Mon Nov 17, 2014 7:37 pm

A different way to look at crowd figures. An analysis here of the combined average crowds of the two largest clubs in particular cities. The cities selected represent the largest combined average in their country. Hence there is no London (101,495) or Barcelona (91,590) for example – btw these are the only other combinations which would exceed the Glasgow figure. Some clubs represent particular areas of cities but if they are included within the metropolitan area I have included them. Where the highest combined city average is less than an individual average in any given country they haven’t been included.

In other leagues – Norway, Finland – there is no preponderance of big city clubs. Clubs in these leagues are spread more evenly throughout their respective countries so it's rare to find two teams from the same city in the league and sometimes it doesn't matter anyway. In Norway’s case none of the three clubs with five-figure averages hails from Oslo.

There are several types of combinations represented. Two well supported clubs but with one much greater than the other (Manchester, Madrid), two of roughly equal size (Glasgow, Milan, Buenos Aires, Istanbul) and some with one hugely dominant club and a ‘minnow’ second club (Paris, Amsterdam, Suwon). In these cases think one Old Firm club plus Queen’s Park.

What’s also notable is the large number of non-capital cities here. There are various reasons for this such as “custom-built” capitals like Brasilia Canberra & Washington DC where the population is much lower than in other cities. Others where the administrative capital is simply smaller in size – Ankara, The Hague, – and some where the number of clubs in the capital is much greater than elsewhere and “dilutes” club support – London, Moscow.

In Scotland’s case Glasgow is obviously larger than Edinburgh but not to the extent of many cities elsewhere. As we know, the dominance of the two Glaswegian clubs is due to what Southern US slave owners liked to euphemistically term their “peculiar institution.” In our case that should be plural. So, on the one hand, it’s a fantastic achievement so see that Glasgow’s two biggest clubs combined have the third highest city average in this table and the fifth highest in the world (okay, not all countries are included here but none of those that are missing are going to trouble the top end of the scale) but on the other a bit depressing to realise there are reasons other than football for this to be so.

Naturally, this is a record of a particular season but there’s no reason to think the Old Firm can climb any higher than third. OTOH it would take a lot for them to fall below ninth – though there are six cities fairly close together in this band. So far this season the OF are running at 76,534. Of those immediately below them the current figures are Buenos Aires 95,000, Istanbul 80,655, Lisbon 79,317 Milan 76,704, Monterrey 72,379.

With just three home league games remaining between the two big São Paulo clubs I’ve used current figures rather than last season’s, as they’re not going to move up or down. With the three cities below that having effectively only one ‘big’ team you can see the OF would have to drop below 23,500 each to fall out of the top ten. Those are figures not seen since 1993-94 (Celtic) and 1984-85 (Rangers). That latter season was the last time an Old Firm combined average (41,790) would have been lower than this season’s 11th place.

But before we get too boastful about our biggest clubs place in the greater scheme of things, we should remember that the OF combined average is roughly similar to one match in Dortmund, Manchester, Barcelona, Madrid and Munich.

It is still an infinitely better position than some once great football cities. The figures from the former citadels of Mitteleuropa like Vienna, Budapest and Prague are absolutely appalling. Put Ferencvaros and MTK together and Budapest just scrapes past 10,000.

One final thing: the Madrid figure isn’t an estimate. It just so happens that the numbers for Real & Atlético add up that way.

122,287 Manchester
117,500 Madrid
90,312 Munich
89,726 Glasgow
86,307 Milan
82,368 Buenos Aires
77,316 Lisbon
70,451 Monterrey
67,729 Istanbul
56,411 São Paulo
51,434 Amsterdam
46,963 Paris
45,935 Saitama
37,505 Santiago
37,000 Casablanca
36,897 Stockholm
35,371 Donetsk
35,000 Tunis
34,270 Bogota
33,852 Sydney
32,914 Bruges
31,651 Copenhagen
30,946 Johannesburg
29,331 Riyadh
27,126 Belgrade
26,631 Shanghai
26,600 Montevideo
26,016 Krasnodar
25,709 Guayaquil
25,389 Athens
24,436 Lima
22,039 Vienna
21,964 Tel Aviv
20,679 Krakow
20,072 Suwon
17,522 Prague
17,122 Bucharest
15,390 Nicosia
11,761 Split
9,966 Budapest
9,485 Ascunsión
7,627 Sofia
5,487 Sarajevo
5,311 Tirana
4,448 Dublin
3,284 Minsk
3,256 Belfast
2,602 Baku
2,187 Reykjavik
2,032 Niksic
1,543 Chisinau
1,459 Esch-sur-Alzette
1,428 Torshavn
1,319 Yerevan
1,053 Tallinn
406 Port Talbot
399 Riga

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Re: Global city average crowds

Post by kickersman » Fri Jan 23, 2015 9:20 pm

Where the highest combined city average is less than an individual average in any given country they haven’t been included. Hence Germany is missing, as Borussia Dortmund’s average of 80,297 is greater than the best combined city average of 80,196 for Hamburg & St Pauli – even though that is the eighth biggest in the world.

Ahem,
the combined average in Munich (Bayern 71000, 1860 about 20-25000 in the second division) is higher than Dortmund's average. So, Munich should be placed third in your list.

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Re: Global city average crowds

Post by Scottish » Fri Jan 23, 2015 10:34 pm

kickersman wrote:
Ahem,
the combined average in Munich (Bayern 71000, 1860 about 20-25000 in the second division) is higher than Dortmund's average. So, Munich should be placed third in your list.

They should indeed - and they are now. Thanks for pointing this out. I've amended it above.

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